Kelly welcomes Scott Barry Kaufman back to the podcast to talk about his new book “Rise Above: Overcome a Victim Mindset, Empower Yourself, and Realize Your Full Potential.”  

To a certain degree, all of us can point to a trauma or disadvantage that was a setback, but at a certain point, don’t we have to find a way to move forward? 

“You know, this really is in line with the point of my book, which is that no one’s coming to save you.  I say that in the introduction and it’s just a harsh reality. I have a whole section in my intro on the givens of existence. And that’s one of the givens, you know, is that no one’s coming to save you. A light bulb moment went off in my head in ninth grade when a special ed teacher took me aside and was like, ‘What are you still doing in special ed?’  Because I was in special ed for an auditory learning disability that everyone thought it meant that I was, I don’t like the R word, but actually I’ll use a different label they put on me, slow learner. So, I was in this moment, and this light bulb went off, like, wow, no one else is going to come to save me.” 

I appreciate that you cite the “Yes, And” concept in the book. 

“I mean, it’s influenced the main thesis of my book, right? An empowerment mindset is a yes and thinking mindset. Whereas a victim mindset is in a lot of ways the opposite of a yes and mindset. You’re not able to hold the space for ‘Yes, I’ve suffered, and I have hope, right?’ Which isn’t that’s what an empowerment mindset is? It’s kind of like the opposite of a yes and thinking. So, I really do want to thank you a lot for impacting my thinking about this and about what it really means to have self-empowerment. To me, it’s being able to hold the both-ness of your emotions, of your own sense of agency and responsibility in the world while acknowledging systemic issues. I can go on and on and on of ‘yes, and’ things that we’re just not doing in our society today. And I think it’s not only tearing our society apart, it’s causing us to view people as the enemy of ourselves when in a lot of ways, we’re the enemy of ourselves.” 

This all relates to self-actualization, right? 

“There’s a rich literature in psychology called psychological flexibility and it’s just the opposite way of what I’m seeing in our society. You know, you can move in the direction of your values even if you don’t feel like it. It’s like people didn’t get that memo. Even if you’re angry, even if you’re preoccupied with your short-term concerns, you can still move in the direction of your values. This is why I created a form of coaching called self-actualization coaching, which I’m really excited about. That’s a big part of my life these days as well. And we just started a training program for coaches, a six-month program where we train them, certify them as self-actualization coaches, already existing coaches.” 

Photo Credit: Samuel Rosen